I dropped Nicky off this morning to get spayed and to get a growth taken off her lip (oral papilloma) everything was fine when I left. I signed the papers that stated "If you're dog is pregnant, in heat, or obese there maybe an additional charge". Nicky is neither of the three.

The vet calls me about an hour ago and asked if Nicky was in heat. I told her no, that she's been out of heat for almost a month now. She told me that her vulva was a bit swollen still and that there may be an additional $70 charge, because of that. The paper I signed this morning didn't say anything about an additional charge for swelling out of heat. Is this right they are charging me for that or does it go hand in hand with being in heat even though she's not in heat? I feel like they are trying to get more money, because she also recommended we do the laser surgery as well, since she is possibly swollen for an additional fee of $98.

They call me back again a few minutes ago and asked me if Nicky has been coughing recently. I said "no why"? The girl said, because her tonsils are enlarged. I asked if that's something I should be concerned about and in sort of a confusing way said "uhhhhh .... not reaaaaally". Nicky has never coughed and has always been in good health (aside from the oral papilloma that she caught from the dog park). Do you guys think this is something I should worry about?



This was taken right before we left for her spay this morning. Broke my heart

Hayden_69 wrote:

She told me that her vulva was a bit swollen still and that there may be an additional $70 charge, because of that. The paper I signed this morning didn't say anything about an additional charge for swelling out of heat. Is this right they are charging me for that or does it go hand in hand with being in heat even though she's not in heat? I feel like they are trying to get more money, because she also recommended we do the laser surgery as well, since she is possibly swollen for an additional fee of $98.

They call me back again a few minutes ago and asked me if Nicky has been coughing recently. I said no why? The girl said, because her tonsils are enlarged. I asked if that's something I should be concerned about and in sort of a confusing way said "uhhhhh .... not reaaaaally". Nicky has never coughed and has always been in good health (aside from the oral papilloma that she caught from the dog park). Do you guys think this is something I should worry about?

I would ask 1. how it complicates the surgery 2. How do you know if it is any more swollen than usual? I know that if anything looked out of the norm on my dogs, I'd know...but I'm a neurotic mess. If my dogs vulva was unusually swollen I'd have noticed. I would opt out of the laser surgery, but that is just me.

Does nicky wear an e collar? Maybe that is contributing to the tonsils? Not sure if it's related but its what popped in my brain.

Nicky does not wear an E-collar yet (just Hayden).

Her records do say she was going into heat month's ago when I brought her in for the pre-exam to get the ok to be spayed. So they knew she was in heat. The vet called and told me I should wait at least 2 month's before spaying after heat. They should have told me that when I set up her appt. but they didn't.

I did notice her vulva was very slightly swollen, but I didn't think that would affect the spay.

The reason for the extra charge is because she may need to be under anesthesia longer IF she is truly in heat; if she is just swollen, the extra charge should be void. When females are spayed when they are in heat, there is a lot more bleeding and more suture material may be required as well. Laser surgery isn't as great as they make it sound, the procedure gets done in the same amount of time when using a scalpel. But that's just my personal opinion lol

Thank you Brooke! Makes me feel better I'm not getting ripped out.

I opted out for the laser surgery originally, but the vet called me back and said it would be good if I allowed them to use the laser.

Also, I know you work for a vet's office. Is the swollen tonsils a concern?

This seems kinda fishy to me, especially the bit about her tonsils. I'd probably be wondering if they were just trying to get more money too.

I can kinda understand them asking if she's in heat. If she was recently in heat, maybe everything just isn't back to normal yet and that's why they're asking you again. Or, it could be that her "normal" vulva is bigger than what they'd consider normal. Still, I can understand them asking you just because of the sheer number of people who come into my clinic and try to lie about their dog being in heat. We won't spay a dog in heat unless the owner really insists, and then its about $100 extra, so we get a lot of people who lie about it. I'm not saying that you're lying of course, just trying to look at things from the clinic's point of view!! If they do try to charge you the extra $70, make sure you know what its for and why it was needed! Our extra fees are for bloodwork (we're low-cost and most people don't want pre anesthetic bloodwork done) and for supportive IV fluids before/after surgery. We only do the fluids if the dog needs it though and if not, the owner gets a refund for that.

The vulva swelling has nothing to do with the spay. The issue is that dogs in heat tend to have a more difficult time with the surgery and tend to bleed more (hence the IV fluids I mentioned earlier). But, like you said, if she's been out of heat for a month then that doesn't really apply to her.

No idea on the tonsils though. If Nicky hasn't been coughing, I wouldn't worry about it. If she is coughing after the surgery, I still wouldn't worry about it too much because they sometimes do after being tubed.

You know, I'm really not sure. I've never seen a patient with enlarged tonsils. I can do a little research on it tonight when I get home though.

Myndi wrote:

This seems kinda fishy to me, especially the bit about her tonsils. I'd probably be wondering if they were just trying to get more money too.

Yea the enlarged tonsils bit was confusing for me as well, if they did the pre-medication exam when they noticed the "swollen vulva" they would have noticed the "enlarged tonsils" at the same time and all of that would have been discussed during the first initial phone call.

ETA- I don't think this pertains to Nikki.

Quick WebMD search-
Tonsillitis and Sore Throat in Dogs

Thank you Myndi! I plan on asking the vet questions when she calls.

It just kinda ticked me off a little bit, because I give this vet A LOT of business! I have 6 dogs and 3 cats, so we're in there quite a bit. Every time I go there I have to wait at least 30 minutes before even getting in a room when other people walk in 10 minutes after me get in a room right away. I even questioned that and they couldn't answer why that was.

I talked to a girl a few weeks ago who actually use to work for the owner of the vet's office I go to and she told me he run's a shady business. If he didn't make enough money that month, he raises prices on other things, so clients won't notice to help make up for his loss. He also gives the doctors a monthly review to see how much extra stuff they sold that wasn't needed. That's why I was curious to know if these guys are trying to pull a fast one on me, because I know about their shady business.

I've been on the search for a new vet office for almost a year now and other's I've tried have been 10 times worse than this place! Finding a good vet is HARD!

hypers987 wrote:

You know, I'm really not sure. I've never seen a patient with enlarged tonsils. I can do a little research on it tonight when I get home though.

Thanks Brooke, I really appreciate it!

No prob! I posted a WebMD article on my last post above. I don't think that any of the symptoms listed pertain to Nicky. You would DEFINITELY notice if she had Tonsillitis. I'll still dust off my books and look it up tonight though. If i'm not to busy this afternoon, I might go snag one of the Dr.s medical books and see if I can find anything as well.

You're the best Brooke, thanks!!

I wonder....could they have been tubing her for surgery and irritated her tonsils? If they did, then they might have called you and suggested that she was coughing beforehand to cover their bums in case she's extra cough-y after surgery. I'm not sure if that could be a scenario or not, but Brooke might know. I haven't spent enough time working "in the back" of a clinic and I'm only on my second semester of tech school, so we haven't done much with tonsils yet .

I definitely sympathize with you Kelly! Finding a good vet is so hard. I finally found a vet that I trusted (where I work at) and he moved, so I started letting two other vets at my clinic work on my critters and got to trust them and they both just moved. As far as the remaining vet at my clinic goes, well, I'm thinking that I'll be shopping for a vet again. That's part of what drove me to tech school. I was so pissed off about all the crappy vets in my area that I wanted to learn how to do things myself so I wouldn't have to just rely on these vets for help. Its frustrating.

It really is!

I'm in the same situation! I had a wonderful vet and she moved out of state. Thankfully, one of my girlfriends told me about a great vet in the same clinic and we were fortunate enough to have been with her until her husbands got orders to move out of state as well. Ever since I've been on the look out fora new vet, but I haven't liked any so far. In my area, money is always #1 on everyone's mind, so finding someone who actually put's the animals first is hard to find.

If a vet is good, they will do a pre-medication exam, it's exactly like an annual exam; they check the eyes, mouth (hence why I was confused at the separate phone calls lol), heart and lung sounds, will do a palpation of the abdomen, check the knees and hips, and check the ear canals. It's pretty much to deem the pet healthy enough to pre-medicate and induce for surgery. Us techs, before the Dr does his exam, take the temp, heart rate, pulse rate, respiratory rate, and CRT (capillary refill time) of the pet for the medical records.

Finding a good vet is murderous sometimes, I don't understand why Dr.s can't be decent?! I mean, why go to vet school and spend all that money and time on something something that you don't care about? I've encountered so many vets that don't like animals, it's almost scary. If your gonna work in this field, you gotta have a passion for animals and their health! lol I got extremely lucky that I work for two amazing vets who care deeply about the health and welfare of their patients AND clients. we even have special discounts for clients that rescue and spay and neuter stray cats. I mean, Kale's vet, Dr. Larsson, calls most of his patients "kiddo" during exams in the the room haha

Kiddo - thats so cute.

The vet just called me and told me Nicky did fine with her surgery and everything looks good. However, she did something really weird after the surgery. They had just taken her off the anesthesia, she was still fully knocked out and about three minutes later with the tube still in her airway she made a gagging type noise and a dark brown fluid came up from the tube and went on the floor and was fully knocked out after she did that. The vet said it had no smell to it and it was really weird and it didn't look like it came from the stomach, especially since the tube was in her airway. They took 2 chest X-Rays and everything looked clear.

She also said her tonsils still looked red and swollen. After thinking about it, Nicky did eat a raw pork rib for dinner last night with bone in it (around 7pm). She's had it before plenty of times, but maybe the bone could have irritated it. I mentioned it to the vet, and she said it's a possibility, but since both tonsils were swollen she didn't suspect that was the case.

I'm taking her home tonight, because the vet isn't 24 hours and there isn't a staff member to monitor her and I want to make sure the fluid doesn't come up again. She'll be staying in her crate and I'll bring her in the vet first thing, so they can check the stitches that will need to be removed in 10-14 days.

They are sending her home with Tramadol and Rimadyl.

Weird! Never hear of brown fluid coming from the lungs before. Are they sure the tube cuff was inflated? That's really odd, especially since the X-rays were clear. If there was fluid in the lungs, the radiographs would show it.

I have no clue! I've never heard of it either ...

Ok I am beyond scared right now! My boyfriends mom was a Vet and he called her up to ask what the brown stuff could possibly be and why it would have happened. He explained to her the situation and he said she is surprised they even openly admitted that to me. She believes the vet used too big of a tube and scratched her throat going down. Which is why they gave me the free X-rays and what not. She also said she wouldn't be surprised if Nicky doesn't start having a really raspy type cough over the next few days.

what did they do? Shove it down her throat!? I'm sooo sry that happened!!

I'm not sure if that is what happened or not. Do you think it's a possibility???

Idk but if what your relative said is true about the fluid, then they must have. It's pretty hard to stick a endo tube down when it's too big; it can even be difficult it it fits just right. I usually pull out 2 different sizes when I'm inducing.

I'm at the vet now picking her up and giving the manager an ear full. Not in a mean way, just letting her know how upset I am and displeased with their work. I know it's not her fault, the vet has already left for the evening, so I'm unable to speak with her directly.

Edit: They were going to charge me $379.25 on top of the $255.50 I already paid. They knocked off $213 and charged me $166.25. I wasn't charged the additional fee for the laser or meds and a couple other things. I'm still not happy with them, but satisfied they at least compensated me a good portion.

Edit #2: She's home and still very drugged up! She seem's to be doing ok, no coughing or anything like that, so that's good news. I have to bring her back to the vet first thing in the morning, so they can check her stitches. Hayden has been very gentle with her and not bothering her at all. He hasn't left her side since we've been home

Have you done your research on the side effects of Rimadyl?

Rimadyl can cause severe, sometimes fatal damage to a dog's digestive tract, liver and kidneys. As such, a wide variety of side effects and symptoms are associated with the drug. While some Rimadyl side effects are less common than others, owners must monitor their dogs closely for potentially dangerous symptoms that include:
Noticeable decrease in appetite or change in eating behavior
Diarrhea or other irregular bowl movements, including black, tarry stools
Vomiting (sometimes containing blood)
Seizures
Partial paralysis
An increase in aggression or unusually hyperactive behavior
Weakened muscles or unusually lethargic behavior
Drowsiness
Jaundice
Rimadyl has been found to be the cause of death for thousands of dogs who were prescribed the drug. If your dog exhibits any of these symptoms while taking Rimadyl, contact your veterinarian right away. The sudden onset of symptoms can be the sign of a much more serious problem.

I don't want to scare you or anything, but I would never give my dog Rimadyl. There are way too many bad stories out there to convince me otherwise. I know sometimes you really have no choice with meds, but I would see if there is something else out there that isn't so controversial.