I come from a state that has been on the frontlines of medical marijuana, and recently legalized adult recreational marijuana use. I grew up in very pot friendly environments. My family was very willing to openly discuss the pros and cons of marijuana with my siblings growing up, and when I was diagnosed with chrons disease, I quickly found myself benefitting from some of the non-conventional methods of ingestion. I spent some of my younger teen-adult years learning about it, and even do grow my own legally for medical use. I won't try to say I don't use recreationally, as well, but it is beside the point.

Lucy has very bad knees and joints in general. It is pretty typical with her breed. We feed her salmon oil, and glucosamine as it is. Her owner told us she also used to blow an occasional hit into Lucy's ear and that Lucy loved it, and seemed to be in less pain for a few hours afterwards.

Now, I know that all mammals have cannabinoid receptors in their brains, so, theoretically it has the same benefits.

Normally, I wouldn't agree with altering the mind of an unwitting animal. Everything about it seems wrong, morally. Lucy, however, I have smoked in the same room as, and it is literally the only time she will run and jump into my lap, in hopes that I will get her stoned.

So the question I want to pose is this: What are your opinions about giving a dog a controlled dose of medical marijuana, if they already seem to want it, and it appears to help them?

Please try to attack this one from an intelligent standpoint. I realize it will probably evoke some passionate responses, but I'm at a moral impass, and could use some help with this one.

I've never smoked the stuff ever, so I'm probably not the right person for the question, but I'm gonna put my 2bobs worth in anyway.

In theory I see how it could work, but how could you say whats controlled? What would be the recomended dose? Would it go by weight or lung size?
The only fears I would have is dogs need a lot more oxygen than humans do.
Without extensive research nad experimentation how would you know what is a safe dosage?

Also what would be the links between mental illnesses in dogs and exposure to marijuana?
I know that a pregnant woman exposed to marijuana increases the chances of her child having schitzafrenia(sp. Would this be similar in dogs?

My first question is, does it have anti-inflammatory properties? (I've never heard of that) With joint problems (no pun intended), it seems that is what she needs. Also, I wonder about dosage - especially when it's essentially a 'contact high' and strains of the plant can vary greatly. Most huskies are quite a bit lighter than the average adult human. Also, even though they have the cannabinoid receptors, their physiology is so different than ours (that's why dogs aren't a standard model organism in medical research). Then there's the whole issue of smoke (wouldn't ingestion be safer on the lungs and easier to get an accurate dosage?)

I'm not in any way against pot for adults. However, I'm on the fence about its use in pets and children until more is known.

Freya, I do not know the relationship marijuana exposire has on mental illness in dogs.

I also don't see any way to control dose for the dog if I just blow second hand smoke in it's face. It seems like the harm of smoke inhalation would negate any benefits. Since my medical use of marijuana requires me to use a controlled dose of concentrated thc in liquid glycerin (Its called tincture, if any of you want to research it). I use 30ml per dose for my 160lb, self, 2x a day, ingested orally. I figured I would start Lucy on .5ml 1x daily, with breakfast. The active cannibinoid content in .5ml is equivalent to 6mg of thc, or about what you'd find on a quarter of a gram of high-grade marijuana, at least in the tincture we make , which is tested by a 3rd party lab.

The benefit of the tincture for me is that it is anti-inflammatory, which helps ease the cramps and constriction in my intestines. Marijuana is prescribed as an anti-inflammatory for arthritis and glaucoma patients as well. Not to mention, the owners actual testimony (I am just fostering while the owner gets moved to Oregon) and what I've seen of her pining for hits.

I appreciate everyones opinions on both sides, please keep them coming.

K9_Eric wrote:

So the question I want to pose is this: What are your opinions about giving a dog a controlled dose of medical marijuana, if they already seem to want it, and it appears to help them?

Are there any studies or information about it's use in dogs and actual proven health benefits and side-effects? I wouldn't ever experiment something like this with my dog without knowing exactly what I was getting myself into and getting the go ahead and correct doses from a holistic vet with experience using it on other dogs and supporting evidence of it's usefulness as well as any and all side-effects.

I am not against medical marijuana use, but only when it's been proven and the pros and cons are fully understood. As of this moment I cannot say that we know all the good and bad effects that it can have on dogs and what dosages are appropriate and therefore I personally would not be supportive of it's use in dogs at this time.

K9_Eric wrote:

Lucy, however, I have smoked in the same room as, and it is literally the only time she will run and jump into my lap, in hopes that I will get her stoned.

K9_Eric wrote:

Not to mention, the owners actual testimony (I am just fostering while the owner gets moved to Oregon) and what I've seen of her pining for hits.

The problem I see here is that we don't know why the dog is "pining for hits" as you put it. Is it because the dog knows that it will get relief from pain, or could it be another reason? I just don't think that because the dog is pining for something that we should assume why they want it. I mean, hell, my dogs pine for any and anything I put in my mouth whether they like it or not and whether it is safe for them to eat or not...doesn't mean I should give it to them.


And just a friendly reminder, keep it civil folks, we're all adults and no one has to agree with everyone's opinions...just be respectful and lets act like the intelligent adults that we all are.

I feel like your doing something thats experimental... And im not being mean but who says your qualified to do so.. I understand its your dog and youll do what you want, but if this was your child would you be blowig second hand smoke into their faces?!?!?!

Ericobeasto wrote:

I feel like your doing something thats experimental... And im not being mean but who says your qualified to do so.. I understand its your dog and youll do what you want, but if this was your child would you be blowig second hand smoke into their faces?!?!?!

Do you just lack the patience to read, or is it the reading comprehension that gives you trouble? Its not my dog, and right now, it gets salmon oil and glucosamine. I'm debating the idea of using medical grade tincture orally for the dog, not blowing smoke in its face..

The truth is that there are not a lot of reliable reports on marijuana for dogs. I mean, up until recently, it was "common knowledge" that Marijuana caused harmful effects in monkeys, but it was because they forced smoke into the lungs of monkeys at the equivolant dose of 100grams of marijuana per day.

Hell, 10 years ago, we had no idea it had so much medical use in humans.

As for the question of would I administer marijuana to a child for medical use? Yes I would, and there are physicians treating kids with cancer and other diseases who agree with me.

What we "knew" about marijuana is rapidly being prooven wrong.

This isn't a dog that pines for anything. You literally cannot touch her without her snarling and biting herself, until she notices someone is going to smoke. Then she becomes a loving lap dog. She apparently knows the marijuana is what she is looking for, and there must be a reason for it.

Do you lack the understanding that i said i am not being mean! And how you were talking it made it seem like her previous owner.... You said "we feed her" you said "used to blow smoke" so it made me think it was previous owner.. You really didnt have to put me down.. You could of just said its not my dog.. Your the one that posted this topic asking for people opinions, i gave mine.. And about kids getting treatment by PHYSICIANS.... Ya that is good and i agree with it.. But the key work here is PHYSICIANS not some random person givimg it to their kid with out a PHYSICIANS approval.

Keep it civil or the post is being locked.

ETA: TREATS ARE NOT A LIKE BUTTON. There was NO reason that K9 Eric (the OP) should have gotten negatively treated in his first post. NO RULES WERE BROKEN and he was asking an honest question.

K9_Eric wrote:

This isn't a dog that pines for anything. You literally cannot touch her without her snarling and biting herself, until she notices someone is going to smoke. Then she becomes a loving lap dog. She apparently knows the marijuana is what she is looking for, and there must be a reason for it.

Yes, but how do we really know why she pines for it? Is it for relief or perhaps she likes how she feels on it? Is there really any way for us to know for sure? Marijuana is widely (mis)used and not for its medicinal properties. Since the food example may be too off let me use another for arguments sake. Sexual intercourse between people both feels good and has health benefits. It's something that many people I guess we could say "pine" for on a regular basis. Now do they want it for the gratification or health benefits? Well, given the individual I'd say to be certain we'd have to get their input to be sure. While sex and mj are not the same I think the analogy serves its purpose in that we can't be sure as to the dogs reason for wanting that hit.

Val, while I see your point, I have to say that I disagree there. Using sex as a comparison/analogy, what does it matter if the animal wants it for gratification or health benefits? In this case, gratification means that it makes the dog feel better...and wouldn't that be the point? We want the dog to feel better because she is in pain. If MJ helps her to do that, what difference does it make WHY she pines for it if the end result is that she's no longer in pain?

However, I do agree that without medical testing, there is no way to know the potential negative side effects for a canine versus a human. But I do think that if the dog wants it, for whatever reason it does, we can safely assume that it's because it is making her feel good. To me, the debate is more about whether it actually IS good in the long run.

My apologies. It's before sunrise, I have a cold, and I'm having an especially hard morning with my stomach this morning. Still, its not an excuse to be rude to you for not reading the entire thread first. It's your right to do so.

Lucy is a foster dog that I care for while her owner is getting her life situated.
She's 7yrs old, Papillion Chihuahua mix, overweight and terribly anti-social with people and animals.

She has the typical Chiahuahua knee and joint issues, and we have put her on Salmon Oil and Glucosamine. Her owner, whom she is not currently staying with is who used to blow smoke in her face, and told us that it seemed to help. We do not administer any marijuana to her or any other animal.

I doubt there is a vet to consult on the matter, but it wouldn't be the first time I've heard of people giving an older dog marijuana to help relieve joint pain. Just the other time it was an old hippie couple with a 13 yr old Retriever.

So, the idea was to use tincture to control the dose. Tincture absorbs through the lining of the stomach, not directly into the blood through the lungs. It has higher anti-inflammatory and anti-nausea properties than simply smoking it, and it wouldn't hurt her lungs.

Physicians aren't neccessarily knowledgable about Marijuana. Vets probably less. My first GI doctor wanted me taking 7 pills a day, including pills to counter act the effects of other pills. I was sickly as hell for months because of that, and he scoffed at the thought of using marijuana as medicine. I eat right, excercise, and use tincture 2x a day at the advice of a different GI doctor, and haven't had a serious flare up for 3 years now.

I hardly want to ask a vet about giving a dog marijuana, and wind up having Animal Services investigate me for abuse.

I used to smoke and yuki would LOVE to be in the midst of it and try to get us to blow it in her face. she'd also try eating it. but i didnt allow her to get high lol. now i dont smoke, but my boyfriend does occasionally and yuki doesnt go anywhere near it, actually she seems disgusted by it.
i had a friend who always got his toy fox terrier stoned. like he'd blow hit after hit into her nose/ears. and she was always fine. it irritated me and i felt bad, but the dog loved it.

honestly, i wouldnt even want to risk it. it COULD help, but then again it could not. although ive never looked into this before so i dont know how it has worked for other dogs experimented with.
i do remember reading somewhere that once THC is in a dogs system, its in there for good.
not like theyre constantly stoned....but like if you tested them months later, results would show THC?
i dont know how true that is of course lol.

Quote :

I hardly want to ask a vet about giving a dog marijuana, and wind up having Animal Services investigate me for abuse.

i laughed so hard hahahaha

Koda wrote:

Val, while I see your point, I have to say that I disagree there. Using sex as a comparison/analogy, what does it matter if the animal wants it for gratification or health benefits? In this case, gratification means that it makes the dog feel better...and wouldn't that be the point? We want the dog to feel better because she is in pain. If MJ helps her to do that, what difference does it make WHY she pines for it if the end result is that she's no longer in pain?

However, I do agree that without medical testing, there is no way to know the potential negative side effects for a canine versus a human. But I do think that if the dog wants it, for whatever reason it does, we can safely assume that it's because it is making her feel good. To me, the debate is more about whether it actually IS good in the long run.

This is the debate that I want to have. She's old, and obviously her health is in decline. Is there merit in giving her marijuana to help her live a better life? I mean tramadol isn't good for the body in the long run, but if a dog is in pain, they get it.

Koda wrote:

Val, while I see your point, I have to say that I disagree there. Using sex as a comparison/analogy, what does it matter if the animal wants it for gratification or health benefits? In this case, gratification means that it makes the dog feel better...and wouldn't that be the point? We want the dog to feel better because she is in pain. If MJ helps her to do that, what difference does it make WHY she pines for it if the end result is that she's no longer in pain?

I guess I am coming from the idea that if it is just to feel better and not because it's doing anything to really help that one would simply use another safer, less controversial method of pain control that has been studied and we know the dosages and side effects for. Nothing wrong with studying that concept either, but I would not support the average person experimenting on their own pet, that's all.

Huskyluv wrote:

Koda wrote:

Val, while I see your point, I have to say that I disagree there. Using sex as a comparison/analogy, what does it matter if the animal wants it for gratification or health benefits? In this case, gratification means that it makes the dog feel better...and wouldn't that be the point? We want the dog to feel better because she is in pain. If MJ helps her to do that, what difference does it make WHY she pines for it if the end result is that she's no longer in pain?

I guess I am coming from the idea that if it is just to feel better and not because it's doing anything to really help that one would simply use another safer, less controversial method of pain control that has been studied and we know the dosages and side effects for. Nothing wrong with studying that concept either, but I would not support the average person experimenting on their own pet, that's all.

I agree with that. None of this is something that I would do personally, but I can see where the OP is coming from. The only time I might be swayed in the direction of trying it is if all other pain meds/tested methods actually do more harm than good or don't work. Like the OP said, tromodol isn't particularly good either, but that's the "tried and true method." Again- not saying I would do it... but I see the appeal if the "tried and true" methods are not working and she's getting "bad with the good" from all other options anyway.

Personally- I'd be more likely to try acupuncture or some other holistic approach first.

Eric i also am sorry for being rude back to you. Basically all i am saying for my opinion is this.. There are some people out there that are going to give their dogs MJ, this wont change. I just think in the end there is not enough information out there yet about the relations between dogs and MJ. So personally i would never give it to my dog. Ive personally never used it because i also feel we dont know enough about it, even though we are close, and some people feel we know enough about it.. For medical reasons for humans i am supportive of it and a person can say if they want to use it or not. A dog cant.. It may seem tht in your case lucy does say she wants it but there is no way of knowing for sure.. Again this is just my opinion and i do feel this topic is intersting. I am not saying i am right or wrong, honestly most likely i am wrong cause i dont know enough about it because ive never even seen MJ before. I have friends that do it and i am glad they respect me enough not to do it around me.
Again i am sorry for being rude to you.

Valerie,
I see your point, and I think it holds a lot of validity. However, she never reacted like this for her tramadol treats when she was prescribed tramadol. She literally runs her fat little self clear across the house and superman leaps into your lap, tail wagging, and ready to kiss you to death the moment she hears the clinking of glass pieces, or a jar open. I've. Wanted to blow a hit in her face just because I feel like I'm teasing her otherwise, but I'm against doing harm to animals, so I've just debated this with myself and my housemates until finally I felt the need to reach out to other responsible dog owners.

I would love to try acupuncture, but I doubt the owner will pay for it, as she rarely sends me a check for food, vet bills, and meds as it is lol. Like I said, she's not my dog. I fostered her and started training her as a favor to the dog, because the owner would have otherwise surrendered her to a shelter, and I'm a sucker for a sob story with a dog at the center.

K9_Eric wrote:

I would love to try acupuncture, but I doubt the owner will pay for it, as she rarely sends me a check for food, vet bills, and meds as it is lol. Like I said, she's not my dog. I fostered her and started training her as a favor to the dog, because the owner would have otherwise surrendered her to a shelter, and I'm a sucker for a sob story with a dog at the center.

In all honestly if the owner was prepared to surrender, why didnt she just let you adopt her? She clearly has little interest in keepng her healthy, given her weight and health, and is not supporting her while you foster. If it is in your means to adopt her, you should definatly look into the benefits of accupuncture for her, though I understand the cost involved being high, and potentially an ongoing treatment.

Koda wrote:

Personally- I'd be more likely to try acupuncture or some other holistic approach first.

Exactly, there are other holistic approaches that may help that don't involve other approved albeit harmful medications such as the one mentioned.

But the original question posted wanted opinions on whether we support controlled doses of medical marijuana in dogs which is all that I am trying to answer. Not so much the debate over whether it should or shouldn't be studied or considered medically in the future. I can't support it at this time given the lack of information and evidence.

Eric, I get where you're coming from and I appreciate the anecdotal evidence but without first exhausting all other 'known' alternatives I wouldn't even consider using mj, controlled doses or not.

Quote :

Personally- I'd be more likely to try acupuncture or some other holistic approach first

I think I would be more inclined to start there as well.


We have huge debates with something as simply as biologically what is the best FOOD we should be feeding our pups. Turning to a controlled (Or regulated) substance for any benefit just feel like shoot darts at a board while blindfolded to me.

Without studies being done prior I would never be comfortable using my dog, or anyone else's dog, as a test subject for this. Regardless of the effects it has on humans, and even with with the proper receptors in place to process the THC, knowing I would never use it on my dogs I could not advocate it for anyone else.

I enjoy the fact of how natural it could possibly be, and all the benefits MJ has in medical applications, I just don't think I could go that far.

Another thing I'm concerned slightly about is how unnatural the process seems for dogs. There are LOADS of reports of animal in nature ingesting things that make them, for lack of a better description, high. I don't know that I've ever hear or read of a dog or wolf actually doing that on their own terms naturally. I know how hypocritical this statement is in essence, as we make our dogs eat or do a lot of things that are far removed from nature, but I think most of us strive for them to be as close to their true nature as we can.


In closing I've seen what too much MJ can do to an animal first hand, I wouldn't go down that road myself. A friend's cat is no longer "Right" after years of second hand smoke.... Again I know you want to stay away from smoke; but there is no telling what dose would be too much at this time in my mind and what could cause serious harm somewhere down the road.

I commend your posts and your positioning, and I get the fact you just want to help releave pain. I just can't say "Go for it" if I know beyond a doubt I couldn't do it for my pups at this stage.

~Chris~

The owner is a friend of mine's mother, whom had recently lost her husband after a yearlong battle with pancreatic cancer. She was left pretty much completely broke with nowhere to go but her Sister's in Oregon, where she is doing her best at entering the work force at fifty-something.
Lucy was like a child to Brian and Karree. Not a dog. It was spoiled to the point of having its own plate of dinner. Things turned bad when Brian got bad because Karree had her hand full with her dying Husband.
Apparently, Karree Is about to have an apartment and be ready to take Lucy by the end of April. I have already expressly informed Karree that we have spent countless man hours training Lucy to tolerate people and animals, not to go crazy whenever we have guests, not to hide under beds and become aggressive, and even to follow commands for meals and treats. We also informed Karree that a stipulation of my returning Lucy is that she continues to follow the training, and I will be following up, as I visit Oregon multiple times a year.

Maybe you can get more background in the meantime and provide her a list of possible, alternative options to better Lucy's health. If she is as much her baby as Tika is mine, I would want to check every option before going an route that is untested and unknown for the most part.
As Chris said, our friends cat is definatly not right after years of second hand smoke. It really doesnt encourage me to think that this would be beneficial in a dog.

Yeah. If she were younger and in better health I would be 100% against it. I really don't believe in it, and have yelled at people for smoking out their animals in front of me.

I guess its just because she's clearly on the downward slope that part of me thinks it would be okay. This isn't a spring chicken we are talking about, its a retired hen.

I really need to talk to some people who have some veterinary medical training beyond my Canine First Aid lol. I'm still undecided. I know the owner would be okay with it, but like everyone has mentioned, we all lack the knowledge to say what the negative effects would be.

Your input has all been very valuable, Id love for this talk to continue, since it is helping me come to a decision about what is best for the dog.

The reason I'm taking my time with this is because I believe that sometimes its better to make what life something has left enjoyable, rather than to simply prolong the length of their life, even if its agonizing.

I will call the owner today and get more background information on Lucy.

We try and welcome open civil discussion as much as we can. All questions and answers help someone in some way as long as both sides are present maturely and are articulated well with proper reasoning or intent behind them.

This is a perfect example of that, and I too would enjoy continuing the discussion.


There is at least one member here working with animals currently in a medical capacity. Maybe they will jump in at some point.


Until such a time occurs however I think you're correct; any insight either way on this is pure speculation. I think that is however the issue some of us are having. Speculation just isn't enough to act on.

~Chris~