Hi everyone,

My wife and I have adopted a 4 month old Siberian Husky puppy. We both grew up with dogs but as I am sure all of you know, labs are nothing like Huskies. We knew that going in since we did loads of research (much of it thanks to this forum) on the breed before committing to a Husky. We have had her almost a month and she is starting to settle in but I have a few questions.

She wasn't housebroken at all when we got her. Her previous owners taught her that her crate is the bathroom and they would leave it open with a pee-pad and that's where she would go. She lived in a fraternity house so there was always someone home so they never really had to lock her in her crate, but I guess no one was willing to actually take her outside. They also used her crate as a form of punishment whenever she misbehaved. As dog owners, my wife and I know that a dog's crate should be like their sanctuary and you definitely don't want them associate it with negativity.

She's now completely housebroken and notifies us when she wants to go out. My wife and I work (at the same place) from 8:00AM - 4:00PM and we have about a 20 minute commute each way. That puts her at ~9 hours in her crate each day. We know this is the upper limit of how long Huskies can usually stand to be alone, so we enrolled her in a doggie day care (which she loves) one day a week. We normally supply her with a frozen kong filled with yogurt and a couple treats for the other 4 days of the week. I thought the Kong might be upsetting her stomach because she pooped in her crate on Tuesday so I didn't give it to her yesterday, and she pooped again. Both days she was literally covered from head to toe by the time we got home. It was a nightmare to clean, and the wires of the crate still smell like poop even though we scrubbed the heck out of them. Any suggestions for breaking this habit? Is this just a classic case of seperation anxiety? Is crate training just not going to work with her because of what she was taught about crates at a young age? She previously had been able to hold it all day while we worked.

Based on what I am reading on the internet, there seems to be two completely opposite schools of thought about dog training. One is the dominance method (leader of the pack/caesar milan style) and the other is positive reinforcement/trust-building (reward the good and simply ignore the bad). The people in the positive reinforcement camp seem to really hate the people in the dominance camp.

Some of what I read states that it's very important to establish yourself as the pack leader for huskies which seems to be in-line with the dominance theory. Some other things I read say that dominance is BS and trust is what is important, and that Huskies are overly sensitive to dominance type of training and it could cause them to distrust you. When I had a dog growing up, we took her to obidence school and they very much taugh the dominance method. I worked great for her, she was the most happy, well-behaved dog I've ever known and she never ever had any trust issues. They taught things like scruff shakes and holding the pup's mouth closed when she bites. Positive training seems to say just ignore the biting and give her something else to chew on, then reward her for chewing on the right thing.

We start puppy Kindergarten Saturday and they use positive reinforcement only but I don't know if I should unregister from this class and find one that uses Caesar Milan type methods. When I spoke to the trainer on the phone (this was about a week after we got the dog) I asked about a situation that we had experienced earlier that day. I had given the dog a carrot and she was eating it. I went to pet her while she was eating and she very fiercely growled at me and was ready to bite.

Here is what the trainer said: "Growling is a warning sign and when a dog does that you just back off and let her calm down and just don't approach her when she has something desireable."

Here is What I had actually did when it happened: I immediately told the dog "NO" firmly, took the carrot away, and grabbed her mouth to prevent her from biting me. She immediately put her tail between her legs, and put her ears back and began to lick me. Then she sat patiently and waited until I gave her the carrot back. When I did, she took it gently and finished eating it while laying next to me.

Since then, she has had no problems with me taking food from her, even while she is eating. Previously when I would give her a carrot she would take it and run away to a corner to eat it, but now she takes it gently and doesn't try to guard food from me ever. If I would have followed this positive method and just backed off, she probably would still be growling at me every time I approached her when she was eating.

Honestly, I don't like the idea of not being in control of my dog. If she were to steal food I want to be able to take it from her. This could save her life if she somehow found some chocolate to eat or something. When we first got Layla we began training her using dominance theory we were familiar with and she really was doing great and was beginning to break her bad habits she developed with the previous owners. Then, I started reading about how horrible dominance training supposedly is so I backed off and tried using the more positive methods only. How do you guys train your Huskies? I really think dominance type training is more effective. Remember I would never hit the dog or anything like that, but I think ignoring bad behavior might not be the best method to teach her proper behavior. She needs to know what is wrong behavior just as much as she need to know what is right behavior.

A tougher question which is likely to start some controversy: I know the breed in general cannot be trusted off-leash.
Layla's behavior is excellent when she is tired out. We can literally walk 5 miles and she will be ready to walk 5 more. The only way I've been able to get her enough exercise to tire her out is by taking of off-leash to run in the field and woods near our house or by letting her play with my parent's bernese or my cousin's german short hair. Getting another dog isn't an option for us yet.

During our off leash hikes (every morning), we've seen squirels, birds, and rabbits and she does chase them but she returns to me when I call her and she will not go more than 100 or so feet from me. There is a rock that I call "treat rock". When we get to the field (on leash of course) she knows to sit in front of treat rock and wait for me to remove her leash. I remove her leash, give her a treat, and say OK!!!! and she is free to run around. She has an absolute blast and I can say for sure that she is at her happiest when we do this. We usually go on a mile or two hike through the woods and she runs back and forth ahead of me and behind me on the trail. I then say "Layla, Treat rock!!!" and I proceed to begin walking back to "treat rock".

By the time I get there she is usually already sitting there ready to get her leash back on and get a treat. Am I playing with fire here? I know Huskies are bred to run and they have a history of running away off-leash, but I can't help but wonder if this idea is based on people who live in the city who are very rarely able to let their dogs off leash so the second they escape or get let off leash they just run and run because they never get the opportunity and they are finally getting an outlet for all their energy. I also read that most sled dog huskies are chained outside whenever they aren't pulling a sled so they are very apt to run and run and run if the ever get loose.

She's too young for rollerblading or bikejoring or skijoring right now so I don't know how else I can get her the exercise she needs. Layla has also bolted out the front door once or twice but has never left our yard and has come back when called.

I live in the country and the only road near the spot where I take her ever morning is a 25mph dead end street at the end of a subdevelopment.

Last question: cats.

We have 2 cats. We have a cat door installed on our basement and they spend most of their time down there. We are well aware of the Husky prey drive and we would never leave the dogs and cats together alone. Layla is actually much more friendly to the cats than the cats are to her. She has never attacked them and she just tries to get close enough to sniff them and they give her a nice swat in the face and she backs off. The only time she will chase them is if they run directly away from her. Other than that, she only wants to sniff them. Any advice on how we could get the cats to warm up to her? We keep layla on a leash at all times when the cats are around.

Sorry for the crazy long post. I look forward to any advice you guys can offer. As you can see, I'm probably reading too much junk on the internet and I'm confusing myself a bit.

Sorry no advice from me but it's awesome how well Layla's recall is! I wish I could say the same to my Lil Girl

I personally use a combination of positive and negative re-enforcement training. Generally a positive behavior gets a positive and a negative behavior gets a negative. Usually the negative is more an interrupt and redirect. I only give the negative re-enforcement only if she is caught in the act. If she tears something up there is no action because she won't understand what the correction is for. As they told me at the shelter, no allows your dog to have a very big world. It keeps them from harming themselves or your belongings and allows them to go do fun things with you.

As far as the dominance training goes I don't follow the whole "your dog must walk next to you or behind you" thing. Roxy is good at loose leash walking and I feel that if she's walking on a loose leash she is following my lead even though she's walking in front of me.

All this being said, I am blessed to have adopted a very well behaved and easily trained husky so I'm generally using positive re-enforcement to train new behaviors. People with more difficult training situations might have more insight.

Welcome.. Great recall your girl has.. I am sure an husky can be trained off leash.. I would not let mine off leash. My male has bolted out of the house on a couple times and we had to chase him down the street (we live in a resideinal area with a very busy street one block from us). My female has only bolt a twice yesterday was once and she checked out the houses across the street then came home. My pups came to me older than your baby. My female was over two years old a rescue and male was 9 months old they had some habits already we had to work on correct.

Some cats can be rather difficult, lol. I have 2 as well. They are both total opposites. My calico has no fear, and roams around the house like she owns it. Lucian will try to play with her, and it takes a lot for her to actually go at him. She won't swat, she will grab his head with both her paws, and bite him. It's actually rather funny, cause she can't get through his fur to actually hurt him, and he just sits there until she lets go. Now my fat cat simply loathes Lucian. Has hated him since day 1. I've had Lucian 5 months now, and she still hates him. It has improved over time though. But if he gets to close she will growl, hiss, and swat at him still. He for the most part will try to sniff her, but knows to back away. It could be a very long time before the cats warm up to your pup.

I appreciate all the replies. Keyda - I noticed your location - I am actually right outside of Niagara Falls myself. Are you involved in any Husky meetups or play groups or anything like that locally?

Here's a pic from the week we got her!

Welcome to the forum I glad you found it helpful and congratulations on your new addition.

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My wife and I work (at the same place) from 8:00AM - 4:00PM and we have about a 20 minute commute each way. That puts her at ~9 hours in her crate each day. We know this is the upper limit of how long Huskies can usually stand to be alone...

At 4 months old 9 hours isn't just how long she can "stand" to be alone, it is really pushing the upper limits of her being able to hold and control her bladder and bowels.

The general rule of thumb is they can hold their urine for an Hour/month they are old safely (Plus or minus an hour). At 4 months you're looking for her to be able to eliminate every 4 hours (5 at the absolute max).

I understand your current problem isn't with urine, however holding "it" for too long can lead to UTIs for the pup.

If one of you could get home for lunch for a couple of months or maybe have a dog walker or friend come over fast once a day to just let her out it may help your create training issues as well as limit the chances of medical issues.

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Is crate training just not going to work with her because of what she was taught about crates at a young age?

How long have you been at it?

But no. If you put enough time and effort in it there is no reason to believe that using the crate as a negative in the old house would translate into yours. Continue making her crate a good place to be. Feed her in it, Reward her for going inside, Leave a Radio or TV on if it helps.

Just take it nice and slow. Make it relaxing and fun. Turn it into a game if you can. Ideally you want to slowly increase the amount of time she is in the crate until she becomes more and more desensitized to it.

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Some of what I read states that it's very important to establish yourself as the pack leader for huskies which seems to be in-line with the dominance theory. Some other things I read say that dominance is BS and trust is what is important, and that Huskies are overly sensitive to dominance type of training and it could cause them to distrust you.

This board is biased. Though we all have varying methods of training most of us tend to agree CM isn't an "Ideal" trainer as he is very rough, both physically and mentally, on the dogs he "Helps".

Most of us are VERY pro positive reinforcement and building a bond of mutual respect between man and animal. Respect shouldn't be build with fear, or pain, but instead positive energy. Huskies tend to do a lot better with positive reinforcement and negative can tend to cause them to defend themselves or shut down.

To achieve this many of us subscribe to Nothing in Life is Free training. NILIF in a nut shell is just requesting a small action or show of respect from the pup before you give in to it's needs. If the pup needs to go out You might ask it to sit and wait while you open the door until you release. During feeding times again you might request your pup to leave it and ignore the food until you give it. A walk can be made very structured and then rewarded with a loose period to explore at certain spots. That kind of thing at it's base. It helps to cement your role as provider in your pups life.

Use play times and or snuggle times for bonding and connecting.

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Some other things I read say that dominance is BS and trust is what is important, and that Huskies are overly sensitive to dominance type of training and it could cause them to distrust you.

The thing you need to understand about positive reinforcement vs. negative reinforcement is there is absolutely nothing you can't do with just positive reinforcement. Anything you can train a dog to do, or not to do, by Alpha rolling, Scruff Grab or shacking, muzzle clamping, muzzle smack, ect. can be trained without any of the mental or physical abuse that comes alone with it. So why would you?

I'm sure your dog was very well trained and happy, training her originally however was probably very stressful for her though. It's important to think about it.

Some of us use a mix of both, and like to use negative reinforcement with some behaviors, but the generally direction of the forum is to remove as much of it as can be done. We all have different methods and that is understandable, we just advocate limiting or eliminating as much stress and fear as you can from your training to develop a deeper bond.

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They taught things like scruff shakes and holding the pup's mouth closed when she bites. Positive training seems to say just ignore the biting and give her something else to chew on, then reward her for chewing on the right thing

Redirection is one method sure, but there are others.

I trained it out of my puppy with commands. While playing if she bit I would say "Ouch" and just get up and walk away until she was calm. Once she was I would start playing again until she did it and do the same thing. To this day she will jump back and sit down if I say "Ouch" while we play.

Because they are so pack oriented you can also use timeouts. Though not entirely "positive reinforcement" they are less stressful and it gets the point across. I use time outs from time to time (Like chasing my cat) and they both know when I say it to go into the bathtub until I release them.

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Here is what the trainer said: "Growling is a warning sign and when a dog does that you just back off and let her calm down and just don't approach her when she has something desirable."

Here is What I had actually did when it happened: I immediately told the dog "NO" firmly, took the carrot away, and grabbed her mouth to prevent her from biting me. She immediately put her tail between her legs, and put her ears back and began to lick me. Then she sat patiently and waited until I gave her the carrot back. When I did, she took it gently and finished eating it while laying next to me.

I instead would have tackled this a completely different way.

I would have left her for a moment and gone to collect a BETTER treat. Maybe a piece of cheese or a smear of peanut butter, or a piece of meat. I again would have approached and let her smell the new object but not allow her to have it.

I would then request she "drop" or "leave" the carrot. It should be a no brainer for them and they should get all excited about the new treat.

Once she did and was looking at me, sitting calmly, and not protecting the carrot anymore I would picked it up and rewarded with the higher value treat.


With this one act I've taught her 3 things.

1) Leave it or Drop it: If I leave the object on the floor alone I get rewarded with a higher value treat.

2) Restraint: I only get the treat if I'm calm and sitting nicely.

3) You are in control of the GOODNESS: Hey that guy walking on two legs has all these good tasting stuff or fun! Maybe I should listen to him more.


In your example you only taught her you are in control and if she doesn't listen you are going to punish her or scare her. And you did scare her.

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She needs to know what is wrong behavior just as much as she need to know what is right behavior.

Ruling with an iron fist can get your training across yes but it is very very stressful. In our above example she was obviously scared of you. I never ever want my dogs scared of me even for a fleeting second.

Just because you use positive reinforcement doesn't mean there can't be boundaries and rules. Dogs are like anything else, they need structure or they grow up just being assholes. But you don't need to abuse an animal to provide that structure. They can read disappointment like a book and know when you are without you having to project it. My Dogs know and understand the word NO.

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Am I playing with fire here? I know Huskies are bred to run and they have a history of running away off-leash...

No one can say but you how she is off leash. As a community all we can say is "When Huskies run they don't stop".

We call it sled head. The ears stuck back, the head goes low, the tongue flies out, and they just burst. They don't look back they just go and go and go. You'll know it when you see it.

I'm not saying off leashing a Husky can't be done, it can with enough training and time. The risks of off leashing however are something you can't just chose to ignore. You could lose your dog forever and you need to be prepared to deal with that. She could run off, She could get hit by a vehicle, Attacked by another animal or person who is scared.

That being said Huskies tend to have a really bad teenage phase. They talk back, they test, and they are mischievous. It is not uncommon for a Husky to be the perfect dog off leash until they hit their teens and then suddenly they take off.

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She's too young for rollerblading or bikejoring or skijoring right now so I don't know how else I can get her the exercise she needs

Mental stimulation is EXHAUSTING for dogs of that age. Train her. Teach her loads of tricks. Anything you can think of. Drop a puzzle toy or ball.

20 minutes of mental stimulation is worth about an hour of physical activity.

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Any advice on how we could get the cats to warm up to her?

Time. Short of dropping them in a room together and having them "Just deal with it" just give them time. Thats what we did. Within 2 months our cats had accepted the dogs... for the most part.



Gave me a run for my money on long winded posting.

Best of luck and hope some of it helps,
~Chris~

There are 2 general thought processes for training. One is reward based, the other is punishment. Each of those is obviously going to branch out into a million methods, theories, and practices. Not all reward based trainers are created equally as the same can be said for punishment based. However- a lot of words and phrases have been twisted around and mean different things depending on who you talk to. The "alpha" theory with dogs has been discredited. When I say "be a leader" I don't mean be "alpha" and walk in front of your dog and constantly make your dog feel like a 2nd class citizen. I mean have rules, boundaries, and structure. If you don't want the dog on the couch don't let them on the couch. Be consistent. Take an active role in your dogs life. That's usually all it means because Huskies can be quite manipulative... Not because they're trying to take over the world but because they're smart mixed with a good amount of stubborn.

From the sound of your post it seems as though you've made up your mind about which direction you're going to take your training. I would encourage you to try reward based training and give this facility a try. Like I said not all places are created equal.

As for off leash... I'm glad you are seeing progress with your very young puppy right now. Just realize however that usually between 6-9 months old things change and they discover their independence and chasing down a squirrel/rabbit/whatever becomes much more appealing than recalling. Don't be lured into a false sense of security and risk losing your puppy. Practicing and training a recall is great, but don't be fooled that this is it.

Thanks for the advice, Chris. I will watch out for "sled head". She will be going into her adolescent phase very soon as she turned 5 months yesterday.

I definitely plan to work with her on training. I didn't realize mental stimulation was so exhausting so that will help tire her out. I read up a bit more and I really like the NILIF training model. I do make her sit before she gets fed and open doors. I think it will really work well with the "working dog" mentality that Huskies have.

My only issue with the carrot situation is what if that had been chocolate or something poisonous? In that case I wouldn't be able to stop and grab a better treat (although that is a good suggestion, I've worked out "trades" with her in the past if she takes an item she shouldn't, like a sock.) I want to be able to take something dangerous away immediately from her without fear of getting bitten. I do think she's learned not to bite or growl at me at this point though, so I'll probably stick with your method moving forward. Reminds me of a situation from my childhood. My mom never spanked me, ever, except for one time when I wandered into a busy road and almost was killed by a car traveling 50MPH. After that, I never did it again, of course until I was old enough to realize why you shouldn't wander into the street. I still wouldn't hit the dog of course, but I think she needed a little scare in this case so that she knows growling or attempting to actually injure me with a bite is just not an option. I wanted her to know this know while she is still small because while a puppy bite is not too big of a deal, she could really do some damage when she is full grown.

It's only been a month and she's already getting a little better with the cats. I accept that they might never be best friends who cuddle together, but I just don't want the cats to be banished to the basement for the rest of their lives. I have a 10 year old Siamese and an 11 year old tabby. The Siamese is very active still but the tabby is kind of slowing down, but surprisingly the Siamese is more afraid of Layla. I am planning to pick up a big cat tree this weekend so they will have an escape route upstairs.

Also, thanks for the crate advice. I have a dog-walker friend who I may get to come over a couple times a week on the days she isn't in day care and we will try to make it home on lunch for the othe couple days. I had read about the age in months + 1 thing for how long they can hold it, but I though I had also read that at around 5 months that no longer applies.

No, I haven't really made up my mind about which direction I am going to go on training. That's why I was asking questions. I am going to give this place a shot on Saturday. The first session is humans only - no dogs, so I will be able to ask lots of questions and make a decision then.

I will be very careful with her walking off leash as it seems like 6-9 months is when she will really get a "wanderlust" going on. Anyone had any success with GPS collars like tagg or Romeo?


Thanks again for all your help and advice.

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My only issue with the carrot situation is what if that had been chocolate or something poisonous? In that case I wouldn't be able to stop and grab a better treat (although that is a good suggestion, I've worked out "trades" with her in the past if she takes an item she shouldn't, like a sock.) I want to be able to take something dangerous away immediately from her without fear of getting bitten.

If you work on DROP ITs and LEAVE ITs now it won't be an issue if and when she gets something later on.

She'll learn the commands and respond when requested in hopes that she gets a treat. You can remove the item and then go get a treat and reward.

You also always have the option to "treat in other ways. Play time is a treat. Praise is a Treat. Belly Rubs are a Treat. Anything you puppy enjoys can be a reward provided by you at anytime .


But I know where you are coming from... I have small god children who crawl on the floor and get into things they shouldn't. My Niece has crawled up to one of my dogs, who was chewing on a bone and removed it from her mouth (I was right there watching). My dogs are trained and expected to remove their hold or mouth from an object as soon as a hand comes close. My youngest one will spit anything in her mouth out as soon as a hand is near her face or mouth.

You can desensitize them in other ways then claiming an object.

Hand feeding your puppy one kibble at a time. It gets them used to hands being around their food. It can also help with mouthing as you shouldn't reward when they nip you to get at it.

Manners and politeness can be trained too simply by asking them to wait before they get to eat until released with a command. You'll notice they start to look at you more and wait for cues.

Once you have trust, and removed the fear away from protecting an item, you can push the boundaries to your liking. During feeding times I would place my hand directly into their bowls and if they stopped, looked at me, and removed their heads they got a MAJOR treat.

I'm not saying the above example should be done by ANYONE or is the "correct" way to go about it. I however wanted my dogs ready for the day a kid crawled up to them and stole something out of their mouth, and it is how I decided to tackle it with the trust I had developed with my dogs.

If you lay the ground work now, when that terrible thing happens you can use training and commands instead of fear and submission to achieve the same result.

~Chris~

layladog wrote:

I appreciate all the replies. Keyda - I noticed your location - I am actually right outside of Niagara Falls myself. Are you involved in any Husky meetups or play groups or anything like that locally?

Actually there is a meet up tomorrow at the paw park in Amherst. Starts around nine. I'll probably leave around nine and get there about nine thirty. I like to feed Lucian early, and let his stomach settle a bit before he romps around with the other dogs.

There's also a park in Lewiston, haven't been there yet. If you want to meet there sometime. I've heard that park is usually rather empty.

I second everything Chris said. I think you really have two objectives in this case: 1) Protecting the dog from the potential dangerous item he has in his mouth and 2) Protecting a child or idiot adult from getting bitten.

As Chris said, LOTS of training "drop it" and "leave it" will eventually cause your dog to drop anything he has picked up. We're close, but even after over 2 years of training this, there are just some things that are too good! Sabaka LOVES the smell of ham...as a matter of fact when he was a naughty teenager, he counter-surfed and snagged some ham. Now he is obsessed with ham. A few weeks ago, my husband had carried a couple ham steaks from the grill to the counter and went back outside to clean up the grill. I walked into the kitchen to find Sabaka pulling a ham steak off of the counter. I will admit I had freak-out voice, but my "drop it", "drop it", "leave it" worked and he just sat there with that ham between his from paws looking at me. It was hard to not go off on him being a "bad boy" but, you know, he left it and dropped it and I had to praise him for doing that.

We place treats on the floor in front of Sabaka telling him to "leave it" and then moving them around and waving them around but giving him other treats because he left the ones in front of him. I think this teaches them (as Chris said) that you have the good stuff AND you will give them some AND you will not take it away from them leaving them with nothing. We also make him "wait" until we give him the "okay" command to eat any food put in his bowl.

There are some annoying habits that we have deemed ones that demand a trip to "time out" (bathroom, not crate). Usually those are the ones that involve being demanding and belligerent. We haven't found an effective way to train him to not be this way, so leaving him or him leaving us is our answer for this.

Hang in there and welcome to the forum!

You already got really good advice, drop it works super well if you just practice, practice, practice! I also always have treats in my pockets, poop baggies are the perfect size if you cut the top portion off to slip into a pant pocket with a few yummies and not be visible. That way you've always got emergency treats. Mine will drop whatever, from rocks to people food, with really good consistency. Admittedly, sometimes she'll throw it aside rather than drop it nicely (definitely has that husky attitude!) but at least it leaves her mouth.
At the same time, desensitizing her to having your hands around/in her mouth is good backup, just do it slowly and make it positive We can open my pup's mouth and grab anything (like fuzz that she can't spit out) as well as open her mouth and smear some peanut butter in there. Then it's all sticky and lolsy- she sure doesn't mind that though!

9 hours straight in the crate at 4 months is probably pushing it. Is there no way one of you can come back during lunch time and let her out for a small break? I know you said you have a commute, but I live about the same distance from my work and I've given up lunch breaks in lieu of going home to let Bandit out. I'm pretty sure at 1 year that he could hold it for 9 hours but I feel bad doing that.

Bandit is my first husky too, and I think the MOST frustrating thing about the breed is the stubbornness. Bandit knows commands and he knows the basic rules of the house, but there's plenty of times where he doesn't give a rats a$$ and just does what he wants to. Example: the cat. I've been using the command "LEAVE IT" for several months now because he just would not leave her alone. He HAD to chase her. Well she's only 8lbs and declawed in the front so she can't handle it. So i'll see him lock his gaze on her and I'll say in a low, firm voice "Bandit LEAVE IT" and he'll look at me, then back to the cat, then back at me, and then he'll just go for it. I react as soon as he jumps up, and will put him in timeout for 15 min. But he'll come out of the timeout and first thing is to chase the cat again. Like I said, he knows what he's NOT supposed to do but there's plenty of times where he does it anyways.

I agree with the positive reinforcement style of training. I also believe there are other ways to show your dog (dogs in my case] that you are the "alpha" or whatever term you want for it. For instance, breakfast time is the meal that we eat together, but they don't get their food until I've gotten mine and have enjoyed a few bites. My bed and the couch I primarily use are off limits to them. If they jump on either, all I have to do is look at them or say their name and they hop down instantly. Most likely it because I've always been consistent in not letting them up there. Nothing In Life is Free is an amazing philosophy, and there are many here who will recommend it.