Hello all,

I have read through the different topics on 'off leash' training or 'recall' as it is known  as here in Europe.
We have a two year old girl Siberian Husky named Sheila. We own her around 4 months. I have been trying to train her to return to me upon command.
I started out using a loud pitched squeaky toy, squeaking in the house and giving her a treat when she comes. I used a variety of treats to make her reward more exciting.
I then started using the same training tactic when walking her on a long lead. This proved successful.
I live nearby a river path walk; at night I let her off the lead with a red light on her collar. She was off the lead and staying nearby, only stretching her distance from me to around 100-200 meters, and returning to me when I squeaked the toy.
All was going well. I was beginning to think my recall efforts in training her were successful.
In daylight, when other dogs were around she would return to the squeaking noise.  I had her regularly off the lead and had now progressed into an enclosed park.  Then I took my eyes off her for a second in the park and she vanished. I searched for an hour, giving out my number to other dog walkers. I returned home (around a 2 km walk from the park, back along the river path walk) and she was in my front garden.
The next day I placed a little name/number tag onto her collar. The following night, again she vanished and made her own way home!
I went back to basics for a week of recall training on the lead. I tried again with her off the lead and she vanished within some bushes. This time a neighbor phoned me to say she had her in her garden.
I took a break for a few weeks and was beginning to reside to the fact that she perhaps will always be on the lead dog.
This morning I tried again. I let her off, it was a beautiful sunny morning and I could not resist.
She again waits for me after around 200 meters. Although today she would only come as close to me as let us say 5 meters, her clearly knowing of the possibility that I could return her to the lead and end her fun. I had to get another dog walker to hold her for me to catch her today.
I realize above is a little long winded, and appreciate one who may of read this far. It is a difficult one for me to nail down, because shows such potential to be off the lead, although perhaps I am fooling myself!!
Where would you place your training efforts next?
Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated!!!
Thanks,
Michael

Hello Michael.

I am going to tell you what others will be telling you. Huskies are not off leash dogs. They were bred to run and pull sleds. This breed has been known to be extremely independent and smart enough to fool you if you give them that chance. They are not eager to please and will just do whatever they want. They're stubborn like that!

Some have had good success, but it takes a lot of patience and consistency. It also deeply depends on the husky's personality. I, personally, wouldn't risk it. We have enough fun off lead at the dog park with an enclosed fence, so that is good enough for me.

I'm not sure if the successful member is still active here, but he/she may chime in.

I managed to train my husky. First thing I noticed is that you only had you dog for 4 months. You need to be more patient. I trained him for a whole year before I trusted him enough in completely open spaces.

It was a LOT of baby steps. And my maximum range is about 50-80 meters. My commands usually get less effective beyond that. I'd never let him go 200m away from me because i can't control him effectively from that distance.

You training seems good. If you see progress your doing it right. But like I said it can be a VERY long process. Keep going and practice in closed spaces. Recall will get more and more effective.

Start in quiet places than put more challenge as time goes on. Don't risk anything, take it easy and you'll be rewarded.

Edit : if you have specific questions I'm all ears.

VintageJeans wrote:

Hello Michael.

I am going to tell you what others will be telling you.  Huskies are not off leash dogs.  They were bred to run and pull sleds.  This breed has been known to be extremely independent and smart enough to fool you if you give them that chance.  They are not eager to please and will just do whatever they want.  They're stubborn like that!

Some have had good success, but it takes a lot of patience and consistency.  It also deeply depends on the husky's personality.  I, personally, wouldn't risk it.  We have enough fun off lead at the dog park with an enclosed fence, so that is good enough for me.  

I'm not sure if the successful member is still active here, but he/she may chime in.

Exactly.


Yep. Not ALL huskies can be trained to be off-lead. Depends on the personality. Since I live in town I would personally never let my girls off-leash in an unfenced area. One- It is for their own safety Two- It is the law. Even in our state and national parks they require dogs to be leashed unless being used during hunting season for that exact purpose. Not sure what the laws are there, but just be aware of them.

This isn't to say there aren't many huskies who can be trained off-leash, but it certainly isn't the norm. Anyone that wants an off-leash dog as a companion I would never recommend a husky.

Again, personally, I just think it is better for their safety not to have them off-leash in town EVER unless in a fenced yard. Not necessarily because your dog can misbehave, but because there are a lot of idiots out there who don't pay attention. Those that do off-leash with their dogs, from what I have seen, only do so out in the country/wilderness without other animals around.

For me personally off-leash in the city is just way too risky. There are too many variables unknown and out of my control that could lead to incidental, accidental, or unforseen danger that at the very least can lead to very expensive vet visits or even worse.

We have had great success with ours off-leash on our friends' property in the mountains out in the woods. There is zero traffic, zero concrete, and zero people around. There we have a clearly defined headquarters where we center around and where the food is and the fire is and where we regularly go back to. There we are always doing something and are always busy hiking, working, chopping wood, hauling wood, building things, hacking away at the trails, etc.

The point is, I think, is that we and our surroundings are always more interesting than anything out in the woods or away from us. I am a firm believer that they don't just run to run. They run to more interesting things because Huskies get very bored and very intrigued very quickly. He feels like he is working when we are there and we engage him constantly and we have learned to channel and redirect his prey drive and his work drive onto us when we are there. For over a year now we have had total success out there with him off-leash the whole time we are there. Their little shnauzer (spelling?....I've never written that word before!) is a total watchdog and she will chase things in the woods away, Link will follow her and return when she does. He of course could not possibly care less about watching on guard but for him I think she is just fun to chase and see what's up when she goes off and does her job.

Anyway, that's our off-leash story. Beyond this, other than dog parks we do not ever have him off-leash, not even for a second if we are anywhere in the city.

Hello Michael,

All I have to say is you and your girl are very, very lucky in these 2 cases that she returned home without injured.
Not sure what is the regulation in Ireland but in the UK, owner can face up a fine without leash their dog in the public and please bear that in mind.
Anyways if you want to give a bit "freedom" to your girl, you can try to use retractable leash or if you want to worn her energy down, jogging or even bike jogging maybe your next best bet.

Good Luck and All the best =)

Grizzly&Charcoal wrote:

Hello Michael,

All I have to say is you and your girl are very, very lucky in these 2 cases that she returned home without injured.
Not sure what is the regulation in Ireland but in the UK, owner can face up a fine without leash their dog in the public and please bear that in mind.
Anyways if you want to give a bit "freedom" to your girl, you can try to use retractable leash or if you want to worn her energy down, jogging or even bike jogging maybe your next best bet.

Good Luck and All the best =)

Thanks, we do not have such laws here. If there was such a law and I got a fine I would not pay the fine, and would give it as much thought as having a piss, to be perfectly honest.
On the note of my dog, I give her a lot of thought which is why I asked the question in the first instance. If I suspected the general consensus was going to be warning me about the law, I would not of have asked. But hey, no hard feelings, each to their own, best of luck jogging with your loved one.
Michael

I want to start off by saying my husky is extremely stubborn, if the door is open he's gone. After walking him a lot (I've had him for 16 months since he was 2 months old), I started to drop his leash while we were walking and he would stay close. At first he would try to get away a little and I would just step on the leash. This is a good place to start and keep him close. On the other hand if you want to let him run a little bit, I recommend an electronic collar. I don't think these are looked up upon on this website but give me a chance to explain.

My husky loves the dog park but a few months ago he started digging anytime he couldn't get a dog to play with him so after countless attempts to make him stop (he's stubborn, remember) I decided to try a collar. The nice thing I've found with this collar is that it has both an electric shock and a vibration mode, I've never had to use the electric shock. The first time he started digging, I pressed the beep button then the vibration button and he stopped. I did this probably 2 or 3 times and he stopped digging all together and I know something vibrating on his neck did not hurt him because I've felt it myself and it feels like a phone vibrating. Anyways, I decided to try this out for off lease walking and ever since that day at the park I've never had to use even the vibration function, only the beep a few times since he knows a vibration is coming if he doesn't listen. This collar honestly just makes my husky 100X more obedient, its seriously crazy and I don't care what people think about the collar especially if they haven't tried it and observed that it really doesn't require any shock or even vibration.

Salesman wrote:

Grizzly&Charcoal wrote:

Hello Michael,

All I have to say is you and your girl are very, very lucky in these 2 cases that she returned home without injured.
Not sure what is the regulation in Ireland but in the UK, owner can face up a fine without leash their dog in the public and please bear that in mind.
Anyways if you want to give a bit "freedom" to your girl, you can try to use retractable leash or if you want to worn her energy down, jogging or even bike jogging maybe your next best bet.

Good Luck and All the best =)

Thanks, we do not have such laws here. If there was such a law and I got a fine I would not pay the fine, and would give it as much thought as having a piss, to be perfectly honest.
On the note of my dog, I give her a lot of thought which is why I asked the question in the first instance. If I suspected the general consensus was going to be warning me about the law, I would not of have asked. But hey, no hard feelings, each to their own, best of luck jogging with your loved one.
Michael

One last thing, do microchip her as well, in case, just in case the tag or collar is lost.

Thanks Grizzly&Charcoal; thanks, she is already micro-chipped!
@JohnGalt; I think the recall training after a long walk shall be a great help, in her training. I do not know the research about the electronic collar, my instinct tells me that it might inadvertently effect her gentle playful temperament, I do not think I would be personally comfortable using one!

Thanks SeattleSibe, I'm not directly in a city and the nearby river-path leading to the park that I mention above are 90% enclosed. It is not a purpose built dog park. I appreciate you pointing out the dangers of escape and roaming away. I think I can make the park 100% enclosed by bringing my partner with me when giving Sheila he run. Your points make complete sense to me. The comparison of your husky circulating, at a nearby distance to your base is what my dog has actually started doing, hence her training was working well until she got bored and seems to have said to herself hey, I can make my own way back to the base .i.e my home

That's great Carl, that you had success. I will definitely follow your advice, thank you. I will work toward keeping the distance to 50 meters.

Just to clarify - I merely wish to give my dog an opportunity to run around, she is an incredibly fast runner. We do not have the enclosed purpose built parks. Thankfully I live nearby one that is 90% enclosed and I shall work towards making this as risk free as possible.

While off the lead along the river, on two different occasions she has caught a rat, tossed the rat and brought it directly to me. Was a sort of bonding experience between us on these occasions.

I would love to be able too, in time hike with her off the lead along with watching her run along with my friends dogs who are non-husky and obedient with recall.

Thanks all for the advice. I only have her four months and I am endeavoring to get acquainted with the husky personality
It does seem that I will have to take stock that I must have her on the lead, because it seems that the breed can simply go onto auto-pilot out of their running and hunting instinct. That said, I think I will continue my efforts on a safer scale, such as making the park 100% safe by asking my partner stand at the entrance gate while Sheila splashes in the water chasing the ducks and rats!
New action plan for my little beauty, which will reflect my own efforts in patience.
1. let her off the lead when with an obediently recall dog.
2. let her off the lead once a week, after a very long walk.
3. Have my partner with me to make the area 100% safe.
4. Start her on a new clicker and whistle regime, because she seems bored with the squeaky toy.
5. I would like to also start training her in 'tracking training' -just to make our on the lead walks more fun for us both.

It is good to know that their is somewhat of a success with some huskies off the lead. Appreciated all the responses, it has been very helpful for reflecting and finding a solution. Thanks very much.

Now, I must track off to the nutrition section because she will not eat her kibble and the Vet said to starve her until she does, although I find starving her like the Vet said, so darn difficult! Funnily enough all her favorite foods seem to be my favorite foods, such as Venison -so back to husky basics for me, learn the nutritionist views and so forth and come back to off leash training in the future. Her personality is definitely definitely taking me on a journey. When my girlfriend found me looking up Siberian holidays and Siberian pet import procedures; she claims I have lost the plot!!

johngalt wrote:

I want to start off by saying my husky is extremely stubborn, if the door is open he's gone. After walking him a lot (I've had him for 16 months since he was 2 months old), I started to drop his leash while we were walking and he would stay close. At first he would try to get away a little and I would just step on the leash. This is a good place to start and keep him close. On the other hand if you want to let him run a little bit, I recommend an electronic collar. I don't think these are looked up upon on this website but give me a chance to explain.

My husky loves the dog park but a few months ago he started digging anytime he couldn't get a dog to play with him so after countless attempts to make him stop (he's stubborn, remember) I decided to try a collar. The nice thing I've found with this collar is that it has both an electric shock and a vibration mode, I've never had to use the electric shock. The first time he started digging, I pressed the beep button then the vibration button and he stopped. I did this probably 2 or 3 times and he stopped digging all together and I know something vibrating on his neck did not hurt him because I've felt it myself and it feels like a phone vibrating. Anyways, I decided to try this out for off lease walking and ever since that day at the park I've never had to use even the vibration function, only the beep a few times since he knows a vibration is coming if he doesn't listen. This collar honestly just makes my husky 100X more obedient, its seriously crazy and I don't care what people think about the collar especially if they haven't tried it and observed that it really doesn't require any shock or even vibration.

Yes, Thanks again John. I have researched the electronic collars. It does seem that they are commonly used in hunting dogs. I never saw my dog in such a prime of excitement as when hunting rodents.
I will talk to some experienced dog owners in the park to obtain their ethical viewpoint, balancing out of course that she can be on the lead, or encounter a few vibrations to lead most of her river path walks off the lead. I'm not looking to reverse anything about my dogs natural nature to run or what not, merely am focused on giving her the best enjoyment possible. Again, today I was at the park and I found it sad for her that all the other dogs that were off the lead, were circling around her, some almost teasing that she was on the lead and the vast majority were not.
I'll give it serious thought, thanks for making me aware of the option. It seems like a practical solution because she is so close to this working for her, being that the problem is she distances herself up to 200 meters from me. When she gets too 50 meters, if I was to initially vibrate progresses to a mere sound in time, then this might very well actually work. Having read several articles and view points, you are right seems that many who have never tried the collar are experts on it. I'm still undecided if it is a route I shall take. I found this article useful http://www.chicagonow.com/training-the-wolf/2013/07/shock-collars-myths/

Thanks for your practical suggestion.

I'd like to add a couple things.

I had to practice with him nearly everyday. Once a week seems a bit on the low side for constant progress. And yes you should practice your recall training when she is tired from a long walk. You can use doggie backpacks to help her drain more energy. The packs also helps to slow her down she does try to run away. It also helps them to switch into working (follower) mode.

The other thing. I notice you saying that she chases cats and ducks. In itself it's not really bad thing. It could bring problems if she tries to catch one at a bad time. Like she is walking calmly by your side and suddenly a cat crosses the street or a duck takes off far away in a field. You need to be able to control her at that time or bad things could happen.

Always think about safety first. She could get hit by a car trying to get that cat or get beyong recall range trying to chase the duck.

I agree that the E-collar could be a great tool to help your training. Just be aware that it's much harder to use properly than not. Timing is key with this tool. Read on the subject.

Like Carl said above, definitely do do your research if you're going to use the electronic collar, if you use them correctly though they're unbelievable. I understand everyone's apprehension with them though, I had mine for 6 months before I ever actually used it, so I do see both sides of it. As for some saying it could change their temperament, we just got back from the dog park and just like always he's super friendly, super playful and not timid at all so I really don't think that's something to worry about if its used correctly. Because like I said all I do now is use that sound and even that is rare (after less than a week!), we went for a good trail walk after the park and I only had to use the sound once and that's because he was trying to cross to the other side of the creek but once I pressed he went right back in the water.

Good luck with whatever you decide to do, but I definitely regret not using the collar earlier, it's not harmful at all and makes walks a lot more fun for both of us.

Edit: One last thing I've noticed is that he actually loves it when I grab his collar because he knows that means he's going outside so the dog really does look at it as a good thing as well.

Rundown wrote:

The other thing. I notice you saying that she chases cats and ducks. In itself it's not really bad thing. It could bring problems if she tries to catch one at a bad time. Like she is walking calmly by your side and suddenly a cat crosses the street or a duck takes off far away in a field. You need to be able to control her at that time or bad things could happen.

Always think about safety first. She could get hit by a car trying to get that cat or get beyond recall range trying to chase the duck.

Yep. Makes me nervous just thinking about it. :S

when my malamute was younger we were able to do everything off leash. Everything! it wasn't until 15-17 months old that she started getting her prey drive and stubborness. My husband has had hunting dogs his whole life. He has trained many dogs off leash. Maggie couldn't be able to because of her prey drive.

I am not saying it can't be done because it can. Huskies and malamutes with lower prey drives are able to be off leash. It's constant and constant training. I met a couple that were walking their malamute off leash. They said he never had a big prey drive so it was easy for them.

I recommend clicker training etc. Maggie did respond to that when I was having her off leash.