Hey everyone,

This is really baffling to me. Last week I went back to work and she didn't have accidents for two 4 hour intervals, however this week today I come home during lunch to there being a tiny bit of poop smeared and there's yellow on the wet paper towel but there wasn't any liquid by the time I got back. Did it dry by then or is she drinking it? Also when I came home permanently after work, once again she has yellow paws but there isn't any liquid in the crate. It's really confusing to me but if it's drying or she's drinking it this is incredibly strange to me. Has this ever happened to anyone else?

Thanks for any and all advice.

Bourbon had an accident in his crate but very small amount and it did not take long to dry but he walked and Sat in it. We only noticed once because of the dried circle Marking in the crate. And then the pee look on his paw and flank.

I actually don't know why I didn't consider that it was a small amount but even a small amount can probably leave quite a bit of color on the floor. Maybe since the bottom of my crate is black it's really hard to see. I guess it is a bit more comforting to know she had a small accident instead of the whole thing, especially since she was very jumpy to get out when I got home.

It's really strange that she's having these accidents though since she didn't pee in her crate previously for at least a week. Should I just view these as setbacks or should there be something I should be more concerned about like UTI? Maybe I'll give it a few days and maybe I progressed too fast overnight in terms of how long I set my alarm for. During the day though it's usually four hours and today seemed to be the first day she had accidents consecutively.

What did you clean up the accident with? An enzymatic cleanser so that the smell is gone?
I would not worry about UTI unless it becomes consistent and multiple times a day in my opinion.
If it just started it could be a setback. They don't consistently always just stop and handle how long. They could have been startled awake in a storm , dump truck , something different could have set them off that day. I would assume that they should be handling for 4 hours. I did notice after Vlad had a bout of diarrhea that I need to potty him twice in the morning once as soon as I get him out of the crate and then before I leave. But those are only 10-15 minutes apart. The first time he's excited saying hi to me the other dogs things of that nature I'm out of the crate for a long time. Then the second time he's paying more attention he has a longer tingle and he actually thinks about whether he has to poop and most time does. But that first time he always ask me and tells me he's ready to come back in.

Hi Colleen,

I really appreciate your response. I always clean it up with Nature's Miracle so I do believe the smell to be gone. Her habits are still a little hard to keep track of though. I work full time so I am coming home during lunch but usually in the morning I let her outside to do her business immediately and then I spend time walking her and then I feed her food and a bit of water. This morning, I woke at 6:30 AM let her out and then by 7:30 I brought her out again to get her to pee before I had to leave for work but she didn't go. She still plays too frequently outside licking the wet grass and such when it's time to do business. I'm assuming this is just puppy behavior but I'd really like her to learn to go immediately if she can.

Also last night I took her out right before bed and she peed, however I put her in her crate and then took a ten minute shower to come out and see that she pooped in her crate. Usually after she pees, I don't hang around waiting to see if she poops because as I mentioned above, she seems to spend a lot of time dilly dallying and previously she would ring the potty bell to let me know she still had to poop once we got inside. I'd really like to crate train her further but am afraid that her whines are actually to poop instead of to get out and play, but it's hard to differentiate the two. Her poops don't seem to be on a set schedule sometimes either so I may have to fall back to feeding her two times a day.

Any further advice would be appreciated. She is my first puppy and understandably a handful but I would love any tips to try to be ahead of the curve and prevent further accidents from happening. I thought we were making great progress as well until these events occurred.

Alesandra
What age is she? How big is the crate? too big is not good
Remember at this age it is probably more trial and error and figure the routine/schedule.

So here is my experiences:
Bourbon came home at 9 weeks and was crated in our bedroom at night and when we were gone. He would eat 3x times a day and 30 minutes after eating he usually had to poo. Before bed if he had not had an after dinner poo we would walk on a leash in the yard. Or he was regulated to the "potty" pen a fenced off area of the yard with only one entrance 10x20'. (We have some woods and plenty of yard.) This was a time that I kept telling him to potty. But we did the leash walking when I realized he wanted to play so we paced the yard trying to get the GI tract moving!! He was trained with potty bells and he did not seem to have an internal bedtime. We took the water away from him at 9 pm then sent it back to 7pm with a couple tablespoons full at bedtime. We tried to keep a schedule. He very quickly stopped getting us up in the middle of the night. At 5 months he was sleeping in bed with us through the night and could get on and off the bed.
Vlad we got at 8 weeks and was crated in our bedroom at night and when we were gone to start. He would eat 3x times a day. He was trained on potty bells and I usually take him out saying lets potty to the "potty" pen a fenced off area of the yard. He seems to want to please and usually if I ask him to go potty he does. His water was originally regulated but he figured out fast where the big dogs water was. He  seem to have an internal bedtime and is chilling on the doggie bed or in his crate after 9 pm.  We try to keep a schedule but he gets a second wind when we potty and get ready for bed. He now gets to fall asleep in the open crate, on the bed or on the chair shut in the bedroom with me. He still wakes up in the middle of the night (1am-3am) and gets ants in his pants. I say this because I believe he gets woken up not necessarily having to pee. But that is the signal to get him out to potty and usually have a poo then he is in the crate until I am dressed in the am. It seem s like a steady schedule now at almost 20 weeks old. Therefore very different from Bourbon. Vlad still has trouble getting on and off the bed but he clearly tells us when he needs off the bed.

I definitely feel we had a routine with each. So I think that is the common factor. The dogs can hold it longer while sleeping than during the day. So I suggest more exercise to tire the pup out more for crated time or a distraction....Have you thought of frozen kongs or other high value treats in the crate. Or feeding in the crate with a feeder toy (not a full meal but a small amount to make a tiny meal. You could do kibble in the kong too.

Last comment I hear that the more you feed them the better it is for them. Yes you would have more poo trips however they would be small poo. We feed three times a day as that is all the we can manage but depending on how late you feed you could break two main meals into two slightly small main meals and two tiny meals in feeder toys or kongs, or even three small meals and two tiny feeder toy sessions. There would be no increase in food but there would be a decrease in how much food is digesting and ready to be poo. (might be easier to hold).

This definitely helps me to understand things better. Thank you!

Rylai is 4 months old in two days. I got her at about 13 weeks old and I started off feeding her 3x a day. I have a large 42" crate but I have it sectioned off so she only has enough room to lie down and turn around. Of course though since she's small now, if she lied down curled up on one end, then she has enough empty space on the other end. Currently, this is how I understand her habits. I feel like during the day she is able to go at least two hours before having to pee, but most likely one hour if I allow her a decent amount of water. She gulps down a lot of water if I let her so I always make sure she cannot drink too much. Poop wise... I feel like it's about 4-6 hours after she eats but I have not been able to pinpoint it exactly. I do admit my feedings aren't regulated on the dot so I can probably start doing that. Maybe I should write down what times she poops as well to track? When you say they are in their crate after 9 PM, this means they are in their crate while you are still up doing your own business right? I wouldn't mind crating her however she is still whining constantly at the moment and I fear her pooping within like she has been lately. I want to ignore the whining but I don't know when she actually needs to go poop which makes me hesitant. I just read so much that accidents in the crate really set you back and I get nervous about further accidents, if it is slowly teaching her that it is okay to go inside.

I trained Rylai on potty bells as well, however soon she started using them too frequently and would only pee 1-2 drops after having peed 30 minutes prior. I liked that she alerted me but I did not want her to understand that we can take trips so frequently and often times when we'd go out after she rang, she would be playing around before finally settling to go. I'm keeping her tethered indoors at the moment, I didn't mind so much her being free roam but I would always try to instruct her to stay in front of me if I was on the couch. She frequently wandered away though so I think for now I will regulate when she goes outside. Maybe eventually she will respect the bells as she gets older.

I have tried Kongs but she pooped in her crate and ruined her previous Kong so I have new ones arriving tomorrow and will try that further with frozen peanut butter for sure.

Thank you for all of your advice thus far it is extremely helpful. Oh and one quick thing, how long do you usually wait outside for them to go? I feel that the longer I wait and they haven't gone, then they might end up thinking it is okay to wait longer to go instead of immediately? She paces around a lot and doesn't go and at this stage I'm not sure if it would do any good waiting it out to see if she goes. If she needs to she usually goes within a minute or so. Poop however may take more pacing, but with the way she's dashing further and sniffing back and forth sometimes I feel like I'm being strung along for play instead of actual poop.

Tracking the routine, you could write it down it might help you get a window of times! Yes routine and structure I think helps ALOT at this age. Sounds like figuring out the poop routine will help you worry less about if she needs to poo or is whining to get out of said crate.


9 PM crate was that Vlad is tired by 9 and he has a crate down stairs in addition to in the bedroom and he enters the crate or the dog bed next to it and goes to sleep and relax at 9 pm. The door is open he has settled himself down and put himself to bed. Granted at 10-1020pm when I am ready to head up stairs I unsettle him by sending all dogs to potty and then head up stairs. There is a bit a tussling and toy play when I am getting ready for bed. I would not crate to put to bed early, nah no need.

Potty bells: when they are this age I take out each time they ring the bells. If they start ringing to play. I leash and take out to potty. Tell them to potty and if they do then reward with play. You can take them out on your own to play but I feel if the bell is rung it is out to potty. Don't want to potty or potty a tiny bit (a sneak) then no play reward.

Kong you can add kibble peanut butter probiotic kefir or yogurt into a mash and freeze the kongs. Use the search topic for Kong as there are a couple threads on what people put in their kongs: fruits, vegetables, yogurts, kibble, mash, frozen, wet food, etc.

As far as the being strung along...have you tried oh you do not need to potty lets go inside for 5-10 minutes (but you have to keep and eagle eye) then go back out side to potty. Want to play nope lets go inside then come back out to potty. Obviously I am not saying never play but I think you get the idea.

Okay gotta teleconference will check back later.

Thank you thank you for all of this advice! I was thinking that I liked your idea of feeding her in smaller increments so it isn't as difficult to hold poop if she ate less food at a time. I guess Rylai does get tired and naps around 9 PM also, however she never wants to really leave my side. I would love for her to go in the crate on her own willingly, she seems to walk in just fine if I tell her to sometimes but doesn't stay in if the door is open. I do tend to do the go inside for 10-15 minutes then take her back out if she didn't potty, but if she doesn't go do you just keep repeating this routine until she does go eventually? I guess at the most in the past I have taken her out maybe 3 times in succession until she has gone. I don't mind trying that but in the mornings when I have to leave sometimes it can be stressful taking her out and then having her not go

I think until she is having less accidents in the crate again I will allow her to be off leash indoors so she will easily have access to the potty bells to inform me. I guess even if she's ringing it constantly, I would only reward her with a treat if she does a good long pee instead of a 1 second squat to differentiate. She does just fine when she is out of the crate and I am around, but maybe that's because I make sure she is always in my sight and I do feel I take her out often enough so she doesn't fail outside of the crate.

Boring phone call so I will multi task.

As far as Vlad going into his crate all mine love their crates. Bourbon and Vlad share a downstairs crate as B does not need to be crated but he still goes in to get a treat sometimes. It is a little hard as it has the divider in it so he is not comfy in there right now. But I am sure once it opens fully he will go back to loving it all the time. When young I feed the dogs in the crate, I also do training sessions asking them to go into "their house" to get a treat and then release from the crate. My aussie is 8 yo and still has her crate for comfort and security. She goes in when nervous or to just get away. She does not have to be crated with the door shut at all. She gets free roam of the house. Which is my goal. Bourbon also now has free roam, he likes to go upstairs and sleep on the bed to get away.

In the morning set yourself up for success. Multiple potty breaks per planned. This is what I do, open crate out to potty,getting coffee then we can go out to potty, send other dogs back to bed, we can go out to potty, grab all my stuff get it ready then go out to potty. Granted I do not do this every morning but these are different times that if I feel I have been cheated a potty then i try again when I hit these stages of my morning routine. I Always do the out of crate to potty and then i now most of the time try a second time.

I suppose your experiences seem more different than mine I don't have an area I can leave her to go potty so I usually have to supervise and wait with her. I got back from the office about half an hour ago (meaning 3.5 hour duration she had to hold it) and yep the bottom of her fur/paws are yellow. I take her out for potential more pee and poop, she spends 10-15 minutes licking the grass. Take her in bathe her cause she's filthy, take her back out. Same thing. I'll keep trying in ten minute intervals but I'm feeling incredibly stressed now I'm wondering if the wires on the sides are stained with potential waste odors which is tempting her... I have to admit those are incredibly hard to clean and she has been stepping in it and standing up when she's rowdy so it's probably very difficult to clean those fully.

When it comes to the crate, I always stop in periodically to tell her good girl and feed her a treat. I also give her a treat after I ask her to go inside if it's for bed time or if I plan on leaving her in there for an extended period.

Yep different ways of getting ready but i am hoping that some information is adaptable so hang in there. I wonder how much pee it really is....... does she ever "leak" during the day when you are around? Could that be something?

Yes the wires get the stuff on it. Vlad had diarrhea yesterday and the wires were definitely harder to clean. She is still young give her time and try to remember patience.

You could put a piddle pad in just to see but that might make her pee on it. I do not really like using them as I think it promotes the concept of pee here. Do you keep one pee spot outside? Leave a little poo there and stand by there to say potty? Some people do that.

I know others that say when it was potty time we took him out on a leash. That way he wouldn't play before potty. We did that until he was about 4 months old. After that he would potty then play without a problem. See she is still young.

Everything you're doing sounds right, so keep it up!

She doesn't really ever leak around the house. These past few pees have all been the same, mild wetness with her body/paws showing the evidence. I agree with you in the sense that I do not want to use potty pads, she seemed to be really improving until now. Should I be shampooing her every time as well to get everything off? I read that you shouldn't bathe them too frequently like once a month but I guess this doesn't count since it would be necessary.

Oh I'm sorry that Vlad had diarrhea in his crate yesterday This is what I hate about wire cages however they seem to be more common for full grown/larger dogs.

When we go outside, she doesn't always seem to have one pee/poo spot which does make things more difficult. She is always outside running around and since I am hoping she will poop after this movement, I follow her. But I did this three times earlier taking her in each time it failed and it ended up being that she only had to pee which was discouraging.

You can give her a rinse every time, and you can do dry shampoo to spritz on and you can do a total shampoo some times. Sh would not need a full bath just a spot or section bath. Hee hee visual half a wet dog!!!

We have a rug protector ( for rolling office chairs) under our crate. It saved us so many times with Bourbon adn carpet. Vlad has the laminate wood now so pretty easy to clean if it got off the crate floor and then protector. But it has not escaped the crate !!!!


Maybe try less water for her.

Yeah I suppose it really is just all a work in progress. I fed her at 7 and she hasn't pooped yet so I suppose maybe she needs 5-6 hours to digest. Seems kind of long for a puppy for her age though unless I'm wrong. I feel bad restricting her water, if I gave her less it would be literally a quick sip then I'd have to take it away. Been bathing her much too frequent though! Thank you so much for all of your help, I really hope she shows improvement soon. She should definitely be able to do 4 hours by now.