I would like to have a calm, rational, non flame discussion with someone who takes his/her dog off leash where it is prohibited. I would like to understand why.

Last week, Bodhi and I had a unfortunate encounter with three off leash GSD's. They attacked him and I kicked the dogs in the head. The woman with the dogs made no effort to corral them and insisted it was her right to run with them off leash. I saw them today, again off leash, but they were far enough away to not have an incident.

I totally understand having your dog off leash if it is voice controlled, but I never see dogs that obey their owners off leash. I only see dogs that won't obey their owners.

My brother who lives in Maryland, has given up running with his dog on the B&O Canal footpath because of encounters with out of control, off leash dogs. He told me there are signs in the middle of the trail and at every trailhead saying all dogs must be leashed. He tells people to leash their dogs and they swear at him, act as if the law does not apply to them. Last week, he told a lady who just stood there while her dog tore into his that he was going to bounce a rock off the dog's head if she didn't control the dog. She responded that she was going to call the sheriff. He said, "Great! Do it. Your dog is off leash; mine isn't."

What I want to know is why people believe they have the right to ignore leash laws. Please explain.

I don't have the "answer" but for the most part we live in an entitled society and people feel that they are entitled to run their dogs off lease and the rules don't apply to them. I'm not about to get on a soap box because Lord knows I could write a novel on this and examples. People don't have the right but they feel like they are entitled to and it makes it harder on the rest of us and we are the bad guys for trampling on "their rights/freedoms" but heaven forbid they see it the other way. 

I really don't understand either. There is a bernese mountain dog though that lives across from my boyfriend that is never on a leash but he listens to his owner perfectly he's just a low energy over weight friendly dog. I have no problem with that but it's like people have no control over their dogs and don't want to take the time to train them

I don't have an answer either. My parents do it with their dog and it annoys me to no end. They think since he is a nice sweet dog that listens well, it's ok. They don't seem to understand that not everyone wants a dog coming up to them, no matter how friendly they are. It frustrates me and when I'm with them my mom always bugs me to let Bode off. I have gotten in fights with her about it and it usually ends with me yelling about how she needs to let me handle my dog how I want to. Ugh.

MGoBlue wrote:

I don't have an answer either. My parents do it with their dog and it annoys me to no end. They think since he is a nice sweet dog that listens well, it's ok. They don't seem to understand that not everyone wants a dog coming up to them, no matter how friendly they are. It frustrates me and when I'm with them my mom always bugs me to let Bode off. I have gotten in fights with her about it and it usually ends with me yelling about how she needs to let me handle my dog how I want to. Ugh.

Hahaha I agree. My parents always had dogs that they let off their leash and they don't understand why I don't let my dogs off the leash. One day she did it in our back yard and Siku took off. Needless to say they have lost their privileges to babysit and I told them if they ever wanted it back that she needed to read huskies for dummies to understand why they are not off leash dogs, and its not just me being paranoid!

But I don't have the answer either, but I read  your story last week and its seems like a lot of other threads lately, that it is making me think that I should start bringing stuff with me on walks. My dogs do really well with other dogs but not when they are on leashes and I hate when people watch their dogs run up yelling "oh don't worry he is friendly" Great for you, but my isn't that receptive to strange dogs and I don't ever want it to be my dogs fault in that situation.

I don't have a issue with it, but I don't do it with my dogs. The other day a dog walked by us with their owner a few feet behind. They were breaking the law. My fiance complained to me and I just said that the dog is being obediant, did not look at our dogs or approach us, and when they got to corner the dog sat down. So, I guess I had no issue. Granted, I think these people are the exception. There is man/wife at our corner that has always let their dogs off leash. They never leave their yard. So, I'm fine with that too.

Frequently enough, off leashed dogs are not that obediant or controlled, which is why cities and other places have leash laws. I think people sometimes fail to see their own dog as having the potential to be bad. When I introduced my puppy to my friends unsocialized dog, she wanted to take off their leashes. I said let's leave them on just in case and I watched my puppy slowly. She trusts her dog. And often I think people who off leash feel the same.

What I know though is those people make it bad for everyone. I'm a smoker. I know it is bad for me, but it is my choice. Since I started, I have always gone outside, away from entrances, so I don't bother nonsmokers. I throw my butts away and try to clean up after myself. It bothers me a lot too when I see smokers littering or blowing smoke out as they enter non-smoking buildings. It just comes down sometimes to some people are incosiderate and unable to see how their choices make others uncomfortable or they just don't care.

Michael,
sorry you keep having issues with OL dogs, im just over the society we live in. People are way to in titled and everyone thinks they can do what ever they want. i really would keep my cell on me and call who ever you need to call and describe the person and dog/s. if its a trail i use a ton with the same issue i might start putting up flyers that say leash your dog or a report will be filed, no mention of who is calling but maybe something to get their attention? and pepper spray if they touch your dog in a attacking manner and the owner does shit i would spray. i think im over being the "nice" lady when it comes to keeping my 2 safe

I'm sorry you have to deal with this- basically it comes down to exactly what has been already addressed. People feel like the law doesn't apply to their dog, because their dog is the best behaved, never mean, always under control dog and they are entitled to share them with everyone.

Unfortunately it's people like this who have taken my favorite horse riding trails from me, as I am tired of getting thrown from my horse when their dogs go for legs. Why people feel their dogs privileges need to infringe on everyone else's is beyond me.

I think a lot of people seem to think that they have well behaved dogs, and it's ok for them to be off leash...I don't know and I definitely don't agree...

Just a couple of weeks ago we were walking the dogs down by the river and a lady had her two min pins walking with her, one of them was on a leash and the other wasn't. Well Kato is not very friendly with all dogs, esp when they come running up to him. He was attacked twice when he was a puppy, so he gets very nervous. So anyways, the dog comes running full force towards us, and Kato starts growling. That's def the reason I keep both mine on a leash at all times. I know he isn't very friendly so I would never put him or anyone else's dog in danger. I told the lady she needs to have both dogs on a leash, because Kato's not very friendly. She immediately grabbed her dog and carried him away.

Still looking for the defense of off-leash behavior...

This woman with whom I had a run in said of the GSD's, "They're just puppies." Yeah , but they were 90 lb. puppies with inch long teeth.

I agree with all comments so far- I am defensive and proactive. Will take any and all action to protect my boy. Short of packing. I have Halt and will use it next time.

The area where I take Bodhi is property owned by the county, but it's accessed by a gated-off, power line road and unofficial trails from people's houses. Animal Control for my county is 20 miles away and they couldn't get in the area without coordination from Bonneville Power. It's a beautiful place to walk or run and most of the time I don't see anyone else there. Maybe that's why people feel entitled.

People are entitled a-holes who don't think the rules apply to them. Just look at how many people text behind the wheel even if it's illegal and enforced where they live.

On a total side note, good to know about the B & O canal. Where in Maryland does your brother live? We're between Annapolis and Baltimore, not very far off the Bay. Thankfully I haven't encountered the asshats who don't think their dogs need to be on leashes, but I had a particularly nasty run in with a dude who had no problem having his 10 lb dog in the large dog park with a huge pack of Huskies and GSDs running around, but then lost his shit when his dog got pinned. We were in the process of trying to ask him to leave, but he wasn't having any of it. He actually threatened to sue me (as the H2M2 leader) and the offending Husky's owner with a lawsuit.

If you're brother is up to braving parks, we'd love to have him out at one of the H2M2's.

He lives in Ellicott City.

I *love* Ellicott City. My mom is from Catonsville, and we're about 25 minutes from there. If I could have afforded a decent house and the commute to Annapolis wouldn't have been a nightmare, I'd have bought there hands down.

I used to run my old dog off leash, but he listens to me. And not the situation where I've convinced myself that he listens to me when he really doesn't. He's a trained guard dog that can be aggressive toward people and other animals, but if I say no and to come he is right there. I think often times people convince themselves that their dog is better behaved than it really is and if it's not listening then it's because of someone else and what they are doing around their dogs. There isn't really a defense for ill behaved off-leash dogs. It's pretty simple, if you can't control your dog(s) off leash then they don't need to be off leash.

A rural deserted area will definitely bring out off-leash. Many people might take their dogs out and never see anyone most days so it's not a problem, but the two days out of the month they do see someone it is a problem. This happens all the time where I'm at and the open quiet places is where I used to take my dog. She should have still worked to leash her dogs when she noticed she wasn't alone though. There's nothing to defend that woman's behavior. Simply irresponsible.

blueeyedghost wrote:

People are entitled a-holes who don't think the rules apply to them.  Just look at how many people text behind the wheel even if it's illegal and enforced where they live.

On a total side note, good to know about the B & O canal.  Where in Maryland does your brother live?  We're between Annapolis and Baltimore, not very far off the Bay.  Thankfully I haven't encountered the asshats who don't think their dogs need to be on leashes, but I had a particularly nasty run in with a dude who had no problem having his 10 lb dog in the large dog park with a huge pack of Huskies and GSDs running around, but then lost his shit when his dog got pinned.  We were in the process of trying to ask him to leave, but he wasn't having any of it.  He actually threatened to sue me (as the H2M2 leader) and the offending Husky's owner with a lawsuit.

Wow, that's classic.. pretty much happened to me, Link was pinning a dog that was about 25 pounds and the owner got all pissy at me, calling me a variety of colorful words and names when I asked him to not touch my dog (he came barreling across the park and shoving Link as hard as he could off his dog which I didn't like) but apparently it was his right to harass me and my dog to 'protect' his dog since my dog was being 'aggressive' even though Link would let go after a couple seconds and I was right behind the guy about to grab Link even when I shouldn't have had to. Can husky owners please have their own husky only dog park and walking trail? xD

We live in a county that does not allow pets off their leashes UNLESS it is stated. I think my favorite example of the opposite happening is when people go to the two off leash dog beaches and then get offended when a dog runs up to them. OR the people that have an aggressive dog, have it off leash at the beach and then yell at US when our Huskies run up wanting to play with their kids, or them etc. Its always such a pain when someone gets upset that our dogs are off leash [when it clearly states on the sign on the beach] that dogs can be off leash.

Other than that, I don't think there is a defensive argument for having your dogs off leash when it clearly states they need to be. The condo complex we live in is extremely strict on this policy. Sadly, I've seen so many people just not giving a care in the world. And sadly, when something does happen [either a kid being bit, another dog being bit, or a cat disappearing], it won't be the off leash persons fault. Or better yet, when their pet goes missing because of the resident bobcat in the area, whose to blame then??

So today, we did not meet the GSD's on our walk/run.

But we did encounter a woman whose dog attacked Bodhi six months ago.
After a calm, rational discussion with her husband at that time, he and I agreed that she would carry a leash and put it on her dog when they saw me. Plus they would always walk counterclockwise on the loop to avoid confrontations. I agreed to always go clockwise also.

So today she was walking the dog clockwise without a leash. We saw each other pretty far away. Her dog went to ground. She turned and went the other way. I waited about three minutes and then continued. She and her dog were off on a side trail and we avoided them.

I feel like I should have a t-shirt that says, "Have Halt. Will spray if your dog attacks."

Honestly, I don't get it. I think these people think that they're "training" their dogs to be off leash and might not be expecting to run into anyone when they're out there, so they think its OK as long as no one catches them (think of "its only illegal if you get caught") which is also why people speed and do other things they shouldn't do. I don't think you're going to find anyone on here willing to defend letting their dog off leash illegally though.